“HR Heretics” | How CPOs, CHROs, Founders, and Boards Build High Performing Companies Turpentine

In this episode, Nolan and Kelli have an honest and transparent discussion with CEO and founder of Remote Job van der Voort (also the former VP of Product at GitLab) on the nuances of running an international remote company. 
Job strongly emphasises how trying to replicate the office environment in a remote setting doesn’t work and how giving small teams extreme autonomy with focus on outcome-based-management far outweighs surveillance and micro management. 
Kelli, Nolan and Job chat about early career growth and development in remote settings vs learning by osmosis in the office and how the company committed to developing new methodologies to mentor and train up juniors.
Job also gives insights into the complexities of global hiring, geography-based compensation, and geographic mobility for remote workers and discusses the impact it has on contracts and mutual obligations.
HR Heretics is a podcast from Turpentine.
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SPONSOR: Attio is the next generation of CRM. It’s powerful, flexible and easily configures to the unique way your startup runs, whatever your go-to-market motion. The next era deserves a better CRM. Join Replicate, ElevenLabs, Modal and more at https://bit.ly/AttioHRHeretics
KEEP UP WITH JOB, NOLAN, + KELLI ON LINKEDIN
Job: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jobvo/
Nolan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nolan-church/
Kelli: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellidragovich/

TIMESTAMPS:
(00:00) Intro
(00:53) Replicating Office Culture in Remote Settings
(06:45) Embracing Asynchronous Work and Team Autonomy
(09:48) Hiring and Training in a Remote-First World
(13:51) Innovative Remote Work Practices and Tools
(17:50) Addressing the Challenges of Remote Work 
(22:10) Remote's Approach to Documentation and Communication
(26:00) International Employment and Expansion
(26:54) Global Employment with Remote
(28:10) Global Compensation Strategies
(33:52) Equity and Performance in Global Teams
(39:40) Mobility and Compensation In Employee Relocation
(46:55) The Global Hiring Market and Future Trends
(51.24) Wrap




This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit hrheretics.substack.com

In today's segment, Kelli welcomes back Janelle Lopez, discussing her recent career decision to take a second-in-command role at Coursera over the top Chief People Officer position elsewhere. She gives us an honest look into her decision-making, her networking efforts (75 meetings!), and how to assess a company for fit.
HR Heretics is a podcast from Turpentine.
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SPONSOR:
Attio is the next generation of CRM. It’s powerful, flexible, and easily configures to the unique way your startup runs, whatever your go-to-market motion. The next era deserves a better CRM. Join ElevenLabs, Replicate, Modal, and more at https://bit.ly/AttioHRHeretics
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KEEP UP WITH JANELLE, NOLAN + KELLI ON LINKEDIN
Janelle: https://www.linkedin.com/in/janelle-lopez-29997a4/
Nolan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nolan-church/
Kelli: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellidragovich

TIMESTAMPS:
(00:00) Intro
(00:27) Career Decision: Chief People Officer vs. Number Two Role
(01:27) Networking
(04:29) Evaluating Opportunities
(08:04) The Real Power of Networking
(12:01) Biggest Lessons From the Job Search
(13:23) Janelle's Future Aspirations
(14:20) Wrap


This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit hrheretics.substack.com

In this episode, Nolan and Kelli chat humanity in leadership with Michelle Weaver, CFO at Twitch (now part of Amazon). Michelle Weaver has 25 years experience including Hired (with Kelli), StitchFix, Axiom, Gap, Inc. and EA.
Michelle emphasises the importance of a human-first leadership approach and that growth and learning can come from the projects you work on, not just promotions. 
The team all agree that building a strong relationship with the CFO builds a strong business foundation and knowing the business you’re in makes you a stronger leader. They also advocate for taking the wins from experiences with bad managers by being the outcome you want to see.
Michelle also offers advice on selecting the company you want to work for and understanding the 'why' behind business numbers. She also goes deep on staying grounded through the M&A process and gives her own spin on personal growth and burnout in high-stress environments. 
HR Heretics is a podcast from Turpentine.
Share this with your friends, forward to your enemies. Get new episodes straight to your inbox: HRHeretics.substack.com.
SPONSOR:Attio is the next generation of CRM. It’s powerful, flexible and easily configures to the unique way your startup runs, whatever your go-to-market motion. The next era deserves a better CRM. Join Replicate, ElevenLabs, Modal and more at https://bit.ly/AttioHRHeretics
KEEP UP WITH MICHELLE, NOLAN, + KELLI ON LINKEDIN
Michelle: https://www.linkedin.com/in/michelle-weaver/
Nolan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nolan-church/
Kelli: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellidragovich/
TIMESTAMPS:
(00:00) Intro
(01:45) The Human Side of Being a CFO
(04:10) Rethinking Team Management and Development
(06:20) Promotions and Organisational Changes
(08:03) Sponsor Ad: Attio CRM
(08:59) The Power of CFO and CPO Collaboration
(12.18) Structural Alignments Within The Company
(15.46) The CPO interviewing the CFO 
(17:16) Choosing the Right Company
(21:10) The Expansion of Gaming
(24:06) M&A Trends and Staying Grounded
(27:37) The Role of a CFO in Navigating M&A Challenges
(30:31) Deep Dive into the M&A Process
(32:45) Red Flags and Deal Breakers in M&A
(37:15) Addressing Burnout and Understanding What Your Passion Is
(42:59) How to Discover Your Passion
(48:00) Wrap






This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit hrheretics.substack.com

In today’s segment, Kelli and Nolan discuss the recent FTC ruling to ban non-compete agreements nationwide in the US, the broader implications of the ruling for employers and employees, and the future of AI and tech post-ban.
HR Heretics is a podcast from Turpentine.
SPONSOR: Attio is the next generation of CRM. It’s powerful, flexible, and easily configures to the unique way your startup runs, whatever your go-to-market motion. The next era deserves a better CRM. Join ElevenLabs, Replicate, Modal, and more at https://bit.ly/AttioHRHeretics
KEEP UP WITH NOLAN + KELLI ON LINKEDIN
Nolan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nolan-church/
Kelli: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellidragovich

TIMESTAMPS:
(00:00) FTC Bans Non-Competes Nationwide
(00:53) Personal Takes on the Non-Compete Ban
(01:13) The Surprising Impact of Non-Competes Across Industries
(02:49) Freedom and Innovation
(05:09) Balancing Trade Secrets and Employee Freedom
(07:33) The Future of Tech and AI Post-Ban
(10:41) Embracing Side Hustles and Innovation
(11:56) Wrap



This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit hrheretics.substack.com

In this episode of HR Heretics, Kelli and Nolan are joined by Kristy McCann Flynn, a seasoned HR professional with 25 years of experience, who shares her journey from working in traditional HR roles to founding SkillCycle, a company aimed at revolutionizing talent development and performance management.
The lively debate covers the evolving role of HR,  why HR software purchasing power might be changing, why  HR practitioners are doing it wrong if the 50% of their time is spent hearing staff concerns, and as ever, the fundamental importance of aligning HR initiatives with business outcomes.
HR Heretics is part of the Turpentine podcast network. Learn more: www.turpentine.co

This episode is brought to you by Attio
Attio is the next generation of CRM. It’s powerful, flexible and easily configures to the unique way your startup runs, whatever your go-to-market motion. The next era deserves a better CRM. Join Replicate, ElevenLabs, Modal and more at https://bit.ly/AttioHRHeretics
LINKS:
https://www.skillcycle.com/

KEEP UP WITH KRISTY, NOLAN + KELLI ON LINKEDIN
Kristy: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kmflynn/
Nolan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nolan-church/
Kelli: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellidragovich/

TIMESTAMPS:
(00:00) Intro
(00:41) The Genesis of SkillCycle: A Response to Industry Frustrations
(01:17) Navigating Corporate America's Challenges and Changes
(03:29) Revolutionizing Talent Development
(04:20) Transforming HR and Talent Management
(04:54) Addressing the Skills Gap: A New Approach to HR Tech
(05:33) The Business Case for Investing in Talent Development
(09:04) SkillCycle's Strategy: Performance, Engagement, and Learning
(09:26) Skill Development vs. Hiring
(13:20) Sponsor: Attio
(16:31) Enabling Your Entire Workforce
(17:39) Investing in Employees Without Bias
(20:04) Burnout in HR
(24:18) The Future of HR and Shifting Focus to Business Leaders
(27:37) Strategies for Professional Development and Growth
(29:04) Navigating Budgets and Building Relationships with CFOs
(31:02) The Importance of Business Acumen in HR
(32:12) Redefining HR's Role Beyond Being a Complaint Department
(37:29) On Engagement and Pulse Surveys
(43:26) Transitioning from HR to CEO: Insights and Reflections
(47:31) Optimism vs. Pessimism in Leadership
(50:00) Wrap



This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit hrheretics.substack.com

In today's segment, Kelli and Nolan discuss Google firing employees who barricaded themselves in the CEO of Google Cloud Thomas Kurian's office for nine hours, to protest Google providing cloud computing services to the Israeli Ministry of Defense. Google CEO swiftly released a 'No Politics in the Workplace' message. The discussion explores the broader implications of protesting in the workplace, raises questions about protests and explores alternative ways to voice dissent without disruption.
HR Heretics is a podcast from Turpentine.
SPONSOR: Attio is the next generation of CRM. It’s powerful, flexible, and easily configures to the unique way your startup runs, whatever your go-to-market motion. The next era deserves a better CRM. Join ElevenLabs, Replicate, Modal, and more at https://bit.ly/attioturpentine
KEEP UP WITH NOLAN + KELLI ON LINKEDIN
Nolan: https://www.linkedin.com/in/nolan-church/
Kelli: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kellidragovich

TIMESTAMPS:
(00:00) The Google Protest Controversy: An HR Perspective
(01:23) Analyzing the Protest: Tactics and Consequences
(02:35) The Fine Line Between Protest and Workplace Disruption
(06:13) Google's Response and the Shift in Tech Culture
(07:48) Sponsor: Attio
(11:31) Exploring Solutions and the Future of Workplace Politics
(14:19) Thoughts on Politics in the Workplace


This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit hrheretics.substack.com